The chances of winning by betting on the dozen in American Roulette are 31. Best roulette strategy ever and it’s the greatest roulette strategy in the world. Double Columns/Dozens Because the strategy above does not cover a large enough area of the Roulette table to benefit from increased chances of winning then betting on 2 different columns or dozens will help solve that. The important thing to remember is that whichever combination. If a dozen wins twice in a row, then we do not bet, but wait until two dozens win. 65% in European roulette and 47. Here are some statistics that may surprise you. This means that if the min bet is $1 your bankroll should be as huge as $40. So, this is also an. -You can switch your bets between columns and dozens if you like to mix it up a bit. His Serbian partner did even better, making £684,000 from his initial £60,000. While dozens are capable of changing constantly. The EV of the combined bet isYou obviously need a very smart System that has more than 50% chance of winning each bet - therefore 1-1 Even Money bets won't cut-it. The idea is to try and protect you from those. It is the most famous and attractive game of the glamorous world of casinos. Players can place bets until the dealer closes the betting session. 2. An independent and uncensored Roulette Scams Forum community to discuss Roulette Systems and Strategies that are scams. Because these bets pay off 2 to 1, that means if we hit a number in one of these two dozen. It doesn’t cripple your bankroll as quickly (compared to Martingale) when on a losing streak, and it also takes longer for you to hit the maximum bet limit on the table. They are also known as 'outside wagers' because they are accessible via the betting layout. Best Roulette Cheat Sheet - Free download as PDF File (. But that will be explained on the next page. With this roulette betting strategy, you’re going to be placing bets on the dozens of numbers, i. Most roulette strategies are based around telling players how they should bet and when to bet it. Place one unit on Square 2-6. The wheel is spun and then a small ball is rolled in a groove, in the opposite direction as the motion of the. For columns and dozens, the bet covers 12 numbers, which means that the odds are 31. The 3 Quadrant Strategy is similar in some ways to the Two Column System, in that it is a hedging strategy where you try and cover a decent area of the table to reduce your risk on individual spins. Everything else remains the same – you wager on a total of. Step 1 - Place a stack of 10 betting chips on the first dozen (1-12) and the third dozen (25-36. Roulette and craps are probably the two casino games with the longest pedigree. The wheel is spun and then a small ball is rolled in a groove, in the opposite direction as the motion of the. Welcome to the best guide to win at roulette. The Fibonacci system is used exclusively for even-money bets – Odd/Even, Black/Red, and 1-18/19-36, all of which have roughly 50% winning chance. Place your chips on the 1st and 3rd columns. g. Immediately, you can probably spot what the big drawback to strategy 2 is–the amount that you have to bet jumps up very quickly. These bets have lower chances of winning in terms of payouts, and your predictions must be precise. What the strategy. Ideally you want to be winning on your first, second or third spin on every quartet of spins. These are outside bets that pay 1:1. Roulette Betting Strategy. If spins are random, the odds of winning are fixed. At the same time it is more conservative than Marty and less risky. See full list on roulettesimulator. With 9 numbers, you will be covering just under a quarter of the table (24. It is simple. Immediately, you can probably spot what the big drawback to strategy 2 is–the amount that you have to bet jumps up. Column bets are situated at the very foot of the layout and cover a single vertical line of numbers. Yet, unlike Martingale, the D’Alembert roulette strategy has a much flatter progression structure, making it far safer to use. Placing wagers on red/black, even/odd, or high/low has real odds of 48. 2 3 2 3 2 1 (we have the Trigger 2 errors = 2 3) There are 2 types of bets to place, back and against. 5:1 and 19:1 on an American. Easy to understand and apply. Dozens is an easy bet to understand. Though the payouts are lower, the odds of winning are much higher. Similar to the popular in Martingale betting strategy, you can play this strategy by doubling up your wager after each loss. Odds: 32. An in-depth guide to the Dozens and Columns Roulette strategy by Stu of Roulette. The alternative way to apply the 3/2 strategy is by betting 3 chips on black and 2 chips on the third column. Spin 2 – 3 rd Dozen. Players will then bet AGAINST that streak based on the theory, the longer the streak, the more likely the next outcome will be an opposite one. Line. The problem with the aforementioned strategy is that a large portion of the table is not covered. Bets: - 2 dozen: flat, with 2 units/1 unit. This is how to play roulette in a casino and online. January 17, 2017, 02:40:55 PM by Nathan Detroit5. 3/2 betting plan; 3/2 betting plan (based on £1 unit stake) Martingale System; Martingale System Roulette Chart; Columns and dozens strategy differences for American and European roulette; Using the columns and dozens strategy in. Looking for a way to beat this dozen W/L Chart. You then drop back to 10-10 and bet this amount 2 times because it will be bet #2 which is an even bet. Players sometimes cover one dozen, others two. 3 units on dozens 2 and 3; 1 unit on squares (corners) 2/6 and 7/11; The only uncovered numbers. Th. . Place a bet on which category of numbers the ball will end up in. You have an MM suitable for the worst to the best times and wins in below average wins. This is easily done with 2 column bets. The 3rd Dozen or 3rd 12 bet on the outside of the roulette table covers the. 89:1). The Favorite Dozen system allows gamblers to receive decent winning. For instance, the first row would cover the numbers 1, 2, and 3. This makes a roulette dozens strategy a good choice for players who want to increase their winning […]TWO DOZEN BET Roulette STRATEGY As we all know, in LIVE Roulette there are 3 dozens: 1st dozen (1-12) 2nd dozen (13-24) and 3rd dozed (25-36). The essence of the Martingale roulette game system is as follows: we bet on an even chance of roulette (red-black, even-odd), for example, on "red": we bet on roulette at $ 1; if you lose, we double the bet and bet $ 2. 37% in American Roulette. The payouts never change. Roulette Winning Strategy 2 Dozen Progression System. The odds of getting 15 spins in a row without a hit in this strategy are 0. 2 1. The best bets you can place in roulette are red/black (check here how to always bet on black in roulette), odd/even, and low/high. For money management I use laBoucher for dozens. strategy gambling roulette. There 15 in each group of either the 1&2's, 1&3"s. 8 and 11. Place a bet on which category of numbers the ball will end up in. In fact, chances are good that a player can win in the first try. Players can place bets until the dealer closes the betting session. Winning this bet pays 2:1, so you’ll get double your original wager as profit in addition to your wager. The second range is numbers between 13 and 24, and the third range is between 25 and 36. Get CEG/CQ Merch Here!this channel to get access to perks:on this roulette game, I will bet on two dozens, with the 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 betting sequence. Simple Paroli System. 1. If you bet $100 on a dozen, you will receive $300 in winnings. The Dozen Grid strategy for Roulette betting is quite flexible in that it also allows for players to bet on columns. The numbers in the sequence determine how much you should bet on every session. Zero didnt matter. CBS Full Complete Betting System. 753% in roulette and is 2. The minimum bets for outside (high, low, black red) and the dozens are . Moreover, you can use a roulette strategy to further improve your results. Strategies in Roulette. — John Doe. Card Counting Blackjack Systems, Gambling Mathematics, Cult, Fraud. A Split Bet or Cheval in French Roulette is an Inside Bet on 2 numbers which pays out pays 17 to 1. 9% of the table, so we will win more rounds. Roulette Dozens Betting Strategy. The Dozen Grid strategy for Roulette betting is quite flexible in that it also allows for players to bet on columns. Some strategies, like Martingale Dozens, require you to cover 2/3 of the table (or just under). Now start looking for a new formation No Bet 0 0 +10. Amount bet £20. Though this puts 25 numbers, or two thirds, up against the. In Roulette, selecting 12 numbers to bet on is almost one third of the numbers on a European wheel since, aside from the one green Zero, there are 36 numbered pockets, 1-36, organised on the betting layout as 12 numbers in each of the three Columns and 12 numbers in each of the three Dozens. To bet two columns or dozens, you would use a different progression of numbers: 1 3 9 27 81 243. Let’s say the next wager loses. Over it, may be you get to see once or twice in your lifetime of playing. It should work with any 2 dozen bet selection method with a decent hit rate. . (double dozen) You can use the progression here 1-1 3-3 9-9 or whatever you prefer. -Half of these numbers are even and the. The 1 - 18 bet on the outside of the roulette table covers the numbers 1 to. This means that if you have 4 losses in a row your next bet will be 13-13. The first column would cover 1, 4, 7, 10, 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, 28, 31, and 34. In total, 38 numbers are represented on the betting layout. HUGE $3000+ WIN! ₿ Buy and Sell Crypto using Coinbase: Discuss gambling strategies on JackAce's Disc. 37% in American Roulette. The number 13 comes in (lucky for some!) in the first column. You will need to have at least 40 chips to apply the strategy. While playing in a local casino can be fun, many gamblers prefer to stay at home rather than visit a land-based casino. Bet the two that DIDNOT hit on the previous spin. You can, however, adapt the most common 50/50 strategies to make a solid roulette dozens system. 6%: 12/37 – 32. The odds vary slightly based on the type of roulette game that is played. Bet selection. We will start with the simplest of the two single dozen strategies, leaving the double dozen until last, and assume players are using a European roulette table with 37 numbers. However, unlike the traditional Fibonacci strategy, the Reverse system involves decreasing bets. Roulette Rules. Started by Nathan Detroit5. As we all know, in live roulette there are 3 dozens: 1st dozen (1-12) 2nd dozen (13-24), and 3rd dozed (25-36). In the context of roulette, you do not need to actually start from one, but from any number — as long as you follow the logic of. So now you are betting $1. As the 2 dozen betting system can offer odds of winning at approximately 64. There are 3 different dozen bets: 1st 12, 2nd 12 and 3rd 12. Bet Two - Third Dozen. 8% of the time, and in the zero pocket (we played European roulette), 4. Diamond codes are specific to your color. So, there are 12 numbers spread out across three columns and 12 across three dozen. Be sure to check out other Romanosky. So, this is also an. So if the house edge is 2. As mentioned, there are a few different approaches available to players. Here are the odds of getting 15 spins in a row without wins on Dozen/Column: European Roulette: (25/37)^15 = 0. Re: The Dozen Drive. A renowned roulette dozens betting strategy is the Martingale System. org) April 15, 2001. With this roulette betting strategy, you’re going to be placing bets on the dozens of numbers, i. When I see 2 or 3 consecutive errors I play in favor, trying to get it right. That brought the group’s take, including from. Spin 2 – 3 rd Dozen. Either ball must be successful for inside bets to win, and if both are successful the win is doubled. Features: - European and American roulette table. We all have heard of a number hitting even 7 times, in a row, somewhere. If you lose again you double and add one unit. Outside bets in roulette. 38% in American Roulette (1 in 296 probability). Once you have your chips you need to break them down into 5 stacks of 4 chips each. 35%, which is the best possible odds you can get when playing. In order to successfully implement this strategy, use the following example: Roulette Dozens Strategy. The previous spin always determines which of the two dozens you'll bet next. Roger switches to £10 on the first and last dozens, as the middle dozens hit last. Winning this bet pays 2:1, so you’ll get double your original wager as profit in addition to your wager. I dont exactly remember the bet amounts but you cover 2 dozens and in the dozen you havent bet you cover 2 sets of corners. . You are now at -$6. 1: A typical roulette wheel and table. Examples are bets on odd or even, red or black, 1-18 or 19-46, dozen bets, or column bets. In order to successfully implement this strategy, use the following example:Roulette Dozens Strategy. We know that dice were first used as a serious incantation to find out what the gods had in store for people. Its roughly a $400 initial bet so if you do get unlucky its very hard to make that money back. Though the payouts are lower, the odds of winning are much higher. For instance, a €10 bet using the 3:2 strategy may consist of €6 placed on red and €4 on the second column of numbers on the table. . Quick Guide to Martingale Dozens. Strategy DOZENS AND COLUMNS. This means you win the same amount of money you bet for the spin. The first thing you should know about playing the roulette betting strategy by dozens is that it is a riskier bet than 50/50. Strategy 1 – You pick a Dozen, any of them, and you bet on it with £1 (you can scale down to 10p if you like and divide the numbers below by 10). 1. 6 times in 1,000 spins (clearly better than winning). If you chose one of each, three numbers would overlap so the mathematics goes wrong. So: 2 losing spins – +1 betting unit 1 winning spin – -1 betting unit Once you are in profit, you go back to the start of the cycle betting a single unit again. Left with 2-3, the stake for the next wager would also be $5 (2+3). Then if you lose, you use the. Then, place one in one of the dozens and the other in. The success rate of these bets is 32. org) on March 11, 2000. You can either bet on a single column/dozen at a time or bet on 2 columns/dozens at a time. . Eighteen numbers (Equal chances: even/odd, red/black, low (1-18), high (19-36) 1 to 1. 1st column: 1, 2, 3. It is simple. The James Bond Roulette System on Dozens, Columns ~ Threats from Casino Chairman Targeting Ion Saliu's Roulette Strategy, Theory By Ion Saliu, Founder of Gambling Mathematics First captured by the WayBack Machine (web. On the fourth you lose. When using this strategy, you move through the sequence as you lose bets and return two steps back when you win. For money management I use laBoucher for dozens. You then need to play five of the 6-line bets, so each stack of 4 chips you. 86%, almost 65% (63. Usually, around 0. Place your bets on 2 columns, for example the 1st and 3rd Columns. If there were the game would have been taken out of any casino a long time ago. . $1 x 35 = $35 (profit or winning) Total payout = original bet + profit = $1 + $35 = $36. That’s why the amount of losses increases. Play the Evens Double Dozen at UK CasinoClub – £700 Bonus. The fact that this system. Place 3 chips on 1, 2 chips on the 2nd, and 1 chip on the 3rd. to the idea of waiting for. This system is interesting in that it gives you a less aggressive progression on the even money bets, than say the Martingale, which it then tries to make up with a final dozens bet where you are covering almost 2/3 of the table. That includes all the matrix systems that bet on 2 dozens. 5. Roulette is a game of pure chance, and barring exceptional circumstances, no strategy can overcome the built-in. The 24 + 8 Roulette Strategy is one of the more simple betting strategies out there - basically aiming to minimise your risk on every spin. After red/black, roulette's second most common strategy is betting dozens and columns. Here are the odds of a particular Dozen or Column not hitting for 15 spins in a row on both European and American Roulette: European Roulette: (25/37)^15 = 0. 8 Posts 3 Topics Re: The Single Dozen by Bally6354 Sep 15, 2023, 09:. if it fails after 5 turns, just get out accept loss. This video is for everyone who is asking to show us a demo of. Essentially, you raise double your. Betting on red or black is also one of the safest bets that can be placed in terms of progression for a. Even with all these different combinations, there are still plenty of other ways to place bets using this roulette strategy. The Reverse Fibonacci Roulette System is a common betting strategy in roulette games. -You can switch your bets between columns and dozens if you like to mix it up a bit. When you select one column there are. Two Dozen Bet Roulette System. Placing wagers on red/black, even/odd, or high/low has real odds of 48. However, instead of a dozens bet, we are going to the columns on the right (2:1). Two Dozen Bet Roulette System As we all know, in live roulette there are 3 dozens: 1st dozen (1-12) 2nd dozen (13-24), and 3rd dozed (25-36). Ok, lets begin: What you will be looking for is a trigger. 18. 1. The aim of the game is to hit your profit target before you get there, or at least identify the bad run and cut short your losses. Roulette columns and dozens strategy Roulette 2023 Jun 9 7 min read DOZENS AND COLUMNS IN ROULETTE The differences between the columns and. 8% of the table, while in American Roulette, the coverage is 63. If this is a better option for you then the sequence of betting needed would now be as follows: These numbers increase in size. The 2 Dozens strategy is essentially wagering that one of the 24 numbers you're betting on will be the one the ball lands in. A roulette strategy has one aim and one aim only: to win. Impressive results by betting the Dozen of your choice! Complete Roulette Strategy! Send us your roulette videos (liv. You will need to have at least 40 chips to apply the strategy. 3. 3. Handy Brandy roulette system (play 30+ numbers). There are 6 possible bets you can make using the dozens and columns strategy. However, even these bets don’t cover more than half of the wheel. By contrast, the ball landed in a red pocket 48. This would ‘trigger’ the player into betting on the 1 st dozen for the next spin. (You can also make this play on the dozens of course). Your favourite free slots games are waiting you. 17 2. How I Play The Two Dozens Roulette Strategy!JOIN THE LUNCHMONEYTEAM TO GET ACCESS TO PERKS is the Column Betting Roulette Strategy? The roulette table is split into 3 columns, each consisting of a dozen numbers. The winning number is determined by real physical variables, like wheel and ball properties, spin spins etc. The column bets are set out within the dozen grids in very neat and easy to see columns of three numbers each. If you havnt the patience for the 1, 3 grind, then instead do 1,3 then 2, 6, then 3,9 and revert back one step once in profit and/or win. Check the progression that you would have to use: 1 – 3 – 9 – 27 – 81 – 243. Discover the best slot machine games, types, jackpots, FREE gamesMake $10,000 a Week Playing Roulette. The closest thing would be betting 3 units on 2 dozens and 2 units on 2 corners on the remaining dozen. The columns are number sequences that go up in 3’s. 891% in craps. It is possible for a two-dozen (two-column) group to hit more than seven times in a row; or, more than seven out of 10 times. The longest streak on 1 missing dozen was 28 spins, but that was very very rare and I only saw it 2 times in 6 months. The fibonacci system uses the fibonacci sequence of numbers to determine how much you should bet: 1-1-2-3-5-8-13-21-34-55-89-144-233-377-610-987-1597-2584-4181-6765-10946-. Play at a table that offers the La Partage or En Prison rules. Make money with us. Quote from: MickyP on August 24, 2023, 03:41:06 PM. On a European roulette wheel, 12 numbers are nearly a third of the available numbers. What is the Column Betting Roulette Strategy? The roulette table is split into 3 columns, each consisting of a dozen numbers. 2, 6, 18, 54, 162, 486. So this means using the Double-Dozen strategy - 64. Column Bets & Dozen BetsRoulette features dozens of pockets. For example, if you bet on 0, you expect to win about 1 in 37 spins (on a single zero wheel) 3. Palestis Single Dozen system is invented by HarryJ and Palestis, both very experienced roulette players. You have to do the combinatory between the 6 possibilities (D and C). So if the house edge is 2. Column bets are situated at the very foot of the layout and cover a single vertical line of numbers. A betting bakery of fun, take your pick of one dozen on the betting grid. I want to spread. An example would be 1, 2, 4, 5. 8%. Suppose, the size of the initial bet is 1 dollar. Even to see 1 dozen missing 25 consecutive spins is rare and you might have to wait a long time to witness that. I love this r. The strategy is played as follows: Player selects their unit size based on their available bank roll, and level of risk. 2. If you bet 1 chip on any one of these the payoff is 2-1 (you will win 2 chips). If you wager $10 on one of the Roulette columns, (disregarding the single zero for the time being…I’ll address that later) you have a 1 in 3 chance of winning. Dozen Bet: If you bet on any one of the three dozen columns, and if the ball rolls to any of the number in the chosen dozen column, then you win and you get 2x the bet amount. I believe its 88% win chance and that will likely be as good as you can get. Roulette is a game of pure chance, and barring exceptional circumstances, no strategy can overcome the built-in. The two dozen roulette betting strategy is a spinoff of the classic, where you bet on 24 numbers instead of 12. It is easy to spot the roulette table at a casino, and the concept is the same online. The uncovered numbers are 0, 1, 4, 9, 12. 3️⃣ How to bet columns and dozens as a roulette strategy? Columns and dozens are a 2 to 1 roulette wager. The game plan for this strategy is easy, we will bet a given unit amount on two of the three dozen bets. Roulette Win Strategy, the BEST Strategy to win at roulette, all strategies found on the web tested for playing roulette and rated on winning chance. Casinos roulette even money betting. If you havnt the patience for the 1, 3 grind, then instead do 1,3 then 2, 6, then 3,9 and revert back one step once in profit and/or win. That is only 1 dozen that has failed to show up. Simply put, you don’t hold back when you lose; you do the opposite. The only type of bet that we are using for the system in roulette is the even-money bet, with odds close to 50-50%. Move 1 step to the left on odd wins and bet once and move 1 step to the left on even wins and bet twice. . For those who don’t know, roulette has 36 numbers (excluding zero). . There is an advantage of stopping with playing after a win. 21-30 is rare. The Fibonacci Dozens Roulette strategy bet example: First bet: $1 My method wins 98. 6% house edge in European Roulette and it’s 5. The Double Dozen Roulette Strategy Is Very Simple To Follow, There Is Nothing Technical About The Betting Progression, & The Bet Selection Is Pretty Much Str. The payouts never change. Nevertheless, the winning probability playing two dozens in single-zero roulette games is p=24/37=64. The roulette quadrant strategy is often used by. 1. A second strategy is to bet on two dozens or two columns. The third column contains numbers 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18, 21, 24, 27, 30, 33, and 36. With its popularity comes a great number of people participating and trying to win big. For example, in European roulette, the 2 Column Roulette Strategy covers 64. 2%; while for the European version, it is 64. Step 1 - Place a stack of 10 betting chips on the first dozen (1-12) and the third dozen (25-36. . 1. Typically, a non-progressive strategy entails betting the. You start with the first 1 and work your way. Anna is betting £10 on the 2nd and last dozens. The 36 numbers are divided into three dozens, excluding the zero on the table. the bet increase at a much slower pace. Download and print our Roulette Cheat Sheet for FREE, and find your best Roulette Strategy to play roulette online at real money casinos. This would ‘trigger’ the player into betting on the 1 st dozen for the next spin. According to our dozens and columns roulette system review research, one of the most popular is. That brought the group’s take, including from. They offer the highest odds. حساب کاربریBut there are professional gamblers out there, including roulette players! They must have strategies, some roulette systems deduced from some figures like the ones above! The player can be ahead at any point in the game. If you bet 1 chip on any one of. If you bet 9 chips and win, you will get 35 chips back, plus your original bet. It is the most famous and attractive game of the glamorous world of casinos. Each group of 4 rows forms a dozen. Bet selection. baccarou, Aug 3, 2023. Roulette 2 dozen progression strategy. The two dozen roulette betting strategy is a spinoff of the classic, where you bet on 24 numbers instead of 12. You can use any of the Column or Dozen bets that pay 2 to 1. There are three dozens on the Roulette gaming table: 1-12, 13-24, 25-36 accordingly. Step 2 – Place a bet of 4 on split bets on the numbers below. The first dozen includes numbers 1 to 12. Dozen bets in rouletteThis strategy needs small Bankroll and also gives decent profit in short time frame. A Split Bet or Cheval in French Roulette is an Inside Bet on 2 numbers which pays out pays 17 to 1. What could be the best progression, money management or staking pattern that works in most conditions? It could be a positive progression, a negative one or a hybrid one. These are better odds then a simple red/black, even/odd, or high/low bet. Although not an exquisite strategy, winning at roulette with Dozens and Columns is a common practice among roulette players. The roulette payout calculator will help you to plan your betting strategy by finding your bet's odds and potential winnings from the initial amount of money you. -Half of these numbers are even and the. 8%. Split bet: This covers two adjacent numbers on the roulette table and pays out at odds 17:1. Spin 3 – 3 rd Dozen. 7% and you bet $1, you can expect to lose $0. If the zero wins, then this spin is not considered. The first thing you should know about playing the roulette betting strategy by dozens is that it is a riskier bet than 50/50. Some roulette strategies require you to place large bets, meaning. Dozen Bet. 2. Here are the odds of the two Dozens or two Columns you’re betting on not hitting for 6 spins in a row for European and American Roulette. Friendly and welcoming Roulette Forum dedicated to roulette systems, roulette strategies and our IN-HOUSE roulette software bots. This approach increases the chances of winning from 1/3 (when betting on a single dozen) to 2/3. 4%. What the strategy. With 9 numbers, you will be covering just under a quarter of the table (24. The pay-out for both betting options is 2-1. The Principle of the Relaxed Roulette Betting System. 027. 7% and you bet $1, you can expect to lose $0. With this approach, you simply need to pick one of the three different dozen options on the board and stick to it. The game of roulette has more potential strategies than any other casino game. Each dozen covers, respectively, the first, second, and third 12 numbers. This means that one of the dozens will have come up twice, and the other once; it might look like this: Spin 1 – 1 st Dozen. On the roulette table layout there are three boxes, located in the middle of the table layout between the numbered boxes and the even-money bets. A win will return you $30 of which $10 is your recovered wager and $20 is your profit. Twelve numbers (Column or Dozen) 2 to 1. The roulette quadrant strategy is often used by. Head to the games lobby of your chosen online casino and select the roulette variant you want to play. The most effective way of knowing if a roulette system is working is by putting it to the test. Log in; Sign up; Roulette Ideas Main Menu. The 3/2 Roulette System. The winning number is determined by real physical variables, like wheel and ball properties, spin spins etc.